marvellouz

Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2016
Messages
9
Reaction score
2
Someone want to try reverse engineer this? They are currently rank #2 for the keyword "man and van bournemouth" and location is obviously bournemouth, but they break all the rules. the website is bhexpress.co.uk, I used placesscout to get all the data.

1) Their GMB business title is removals, man and van hire bournemouth - which is obviously spam as their website is bhexpress and what business title has a comma in it?

2) They are furthest from the centre compared to the other 4.

3) They have the lowest amount of backlinks which is like 1-5 depending on which data you use compared to 34/42 for #3 and #4.

4) They have the lowest Majestic TF, CF, Moz PA, DA, ahref PR, DR.

5) They have the lowest amount of citations.

6) They have a spammy title which consist of 21 words (keyword stuffing penalty anyone?)

7) I cant even find their FB page

8) They have no social signals

Now if we are to believe Moz local ranking signals which is:
backlinks(none), onpage(spam), GMB(inconsistent and spam name), citations (virtually none), reviews (none), social signals (none) - How are they ranking #2?

I'm puzzled. Thanks for playing :p
 
Joined
Oct 25, 2013
Messages
752
Reaction score
286
Capture.JPG

I looked up man and van bournemouth, and this is what I'm seeing... same for you? Notice how there's an A, B, and C along the left instead of 1, 2, 3. That means it's a brand 3 pack, not a regular 3 pack. Ranking factors are a bit different, some of the standard factors matter less for brand keywords. Joy wrote an article about that a bit ago, you can read it here.

Notice, in the case Joy wrote about at least, for branded keywords having a good domain matters less, organic ranking factors matter less, a lot of the things you pointed out don't help as much for a branded search. Of course, business name also mattered less in that case study, which is a little strange since that's about all this listing has going for it. I looked up their address, it's pretty far outside the city.

Either way, my guess is you're seeing this result because it's a brand search 3-pack instead, so it follows some different ranking rules. If you or a client are competing with this company, I'd start by investigating if it's even a real business, and if it is, getting the name changed to the real name (BH Express it looks like?) will likely help knock them down a few pegs.

Capture.JPG
 

marvellouz

Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2016
Messages
9
Reaction score
2
Thanks for that new bit of information I didn't know about branded pack. That said it still doesn't answer my question unfortunately.

Hidden addresses may hinder ranking for a branded 3-pack - he has hidden address my client doesn't. It's the 247.

Location mattered more for branded 3-packs. - I'm closer to location than he is based on postcode.


Using the proper primary category mattered More for branded 3 packs - we have the same primary category.
 

theitsage

Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2015
Messages
56
Reaction score
16
Hidden address and 24/7 Open is a blackhat technique to rank well in Local. I hope Google fixes this soon.
 
Joined
Oct 25, 2013
Messages
752
Reaction score
286
As I said, he's using a fake business name. Google has too many factors, many of which you have no way of tracking (for example, what's his bounce rate/CTR? That alone could make the difference) your goal shouldn't be to understand exactly why he's there, you can't pin it down that well. You can however look for ways to either fairly knock him down a peg, or see things he's doing that you're not. Here's Joy's guide on spam fighting, follow her steps to figure out his real business name and get it changed. That alone should get him down below you again.
 
Joined
Oct 25, 2013
Messages
752
Reaction score
286
As I said, Joy's article is the place to go for figuring that out. Since Removals, man and van hire Bournemouth is a verified business, you should make the edit in Google maps, suggest an edit. There's no place there for comments, so just make the edit to the correct business name, and if it gets denied, appeal on the GMB forum, along with the proof you've got that they're lying about their name. That'll get it changed.
 

marvellouz

Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2016
Messages
9
Reaction score
2
Thanks they're definitely doing something black hat but I'm wondering what.

Now they're rank 2 and 4 at the same time. Anyone knows what they could possibly be doing to achieve this? Will help us understand the algorithm better.
 
Joined
Oct 25, 2013
Messages
752
Reaction score
286
It is curious that it's up so high organically as well, but as I said, it's not useful to spend too much time coming up with theories in specific cases like this. The best studies are all going to involve larger data sets, like this one. As I mentioned, there's any number of ways they could skew results that wouldn't show up in any tools we have access to. (Bots for influencing CTR and bounce rate for example, either to raise theirs or to tank statistics for the competition). I'm not saying that's what they're doing of course, I'm just saying that I've pointed out everything that's jumped out to me, at this point I'd move on to mitigation. In any science, theories aren't helpful unless you have a plan for testing them, which you can't do when looking at a single business like this. There's only so many hours in the day, and your primary task presumably isn't to fully understand every single ranking factor and it's weight that Google is using in this case, it's just to influence the rankings so that more deserving companies are up top instead. Wisdom without application doesn't help anyone after all.

So, since their GMB name is clearly spam, get their name cleaned up and see if that helps.
 

JoshuaMackens

Local Search Expert
Joined
Sep 12, 2012
Messages
1,949
Reaction score
579
Granted I only skimmed this, but this seems fairly obvious unless I'm missing something. Their keywords are in their GMB.

Game, set, match.

Also, James is giving good advice. Don't focus so much on what they are doing correctly as much as what you can improve upon for yourself.
 
Similar threads
Thread starter Title Forum Replies Date
M How does this business meeting 0 of the ranking signals rank #2? Ranking Puzzles 9
L Does selecting a service area for hidden address business have negative effects? Moving or Name Changes 1
Steve Wiideman Does anyone have a Google My Business claiming best practice guide? Google My Business & Google Maps 3
K Map Pin Does Not Show When Business Owner Googles Their Address Google My Business & Google Maps 1
TammyT Does city in business name increase local pack visibility Local Search 7
kathleen.rhodes Google's My Business Provider - how does a Chamber of Commerce sign up Help & Support for Google Local 6
F How Does a Business Deal with Fake Reviews? Recycle Bin 0
ashley.smith Does Google My Business prioritize reviews from Local Guides over other users? Local Reviews 7
LocalSEODat How Does a Business Deal with Fake Reviews? Local Reviews 32
Conor Treacy Report Business "Doesn't Exist" - does it work? Google My Business & Google Maps 12
Oliver Keates Does my GMB short name have to match the business name for my listing to be optimised? Google My Business & Google Maps 9
Grabgooglesgoogles Verified and optimised GMB listing doesn't show up on maps when viewing the street (unlike every other local business which does). Help & Support for Google Local 8
Garrett Sussman Does Your Local Business Need a Website in 2017? Local Reviews 0
Tim Colling Does Google care about unlicensed businesses that have Maps listings? Local Search 10
Scott ClientClicks Using mapmaker to remove business name spam. Does a DBA make it OK? Google My Business & Google Maps 1
Colan Nielsen Why the $%!# Does Google Keep Updating My Business Hours? (A Case Study) Google My Business & Google Maps 5
M Does adding a suite # for businesses sharing the same address solve NAP issue? Google My Business & Google Maps 1
Lloyd Silver What benefits does a business get from Google Plus other than the local pack Google My Business & Google Maps 9
Dustybones Does Google have more verified business pages than Facebook? Google My Business & Google Maps 0
R New Dashboard - Business Description Format does not transfer G+ site Local Search 1
K Does review schema work for local businesses or just products? Local Search 0
Jo Shaer Where does the profile pic on the G+ Business Pages come from? Google My Business & Google Maps 11
Linda Buquet Does Google Hate Small Businesses? Asks Hubspot Local Search 4
JoyHawkins Does Merging your G+ Local and Business Page Result in Increased Ranking Local Search 6
Marc Simcox Does Google scrape business filings? Local Search 1
NexstarNickR Does PPC Perform worse if there are no trackable goals? Ask a LocalU Expert [PRIVATE] (LocalU) 4
Rich Owings Does "near me" optimization bring more organic or GMB clicks? Organic SEO 4
NickB-Tampa Why does Google keep updating changing the main category on our listings to ones that don't make as much sense? NAP, Categories, Dashboard Data 2
eshad Account suspended, duplicate created. Suspended listing shows. Verified listing does not Google Duplicates & Merges 3
M Where does this type of SPAM come from? Spam on Google 7
P Does suspended listing affect account quality? Google My Business & Google Maps 4
I How does URL Shortening sites like Umuly work? Websites, Software, and Security 0
djbaxter Google: Moz Spam Score, Domain Authority Does Not Impact Google Rankings Organic SEO 1
Eoghan_MFeed Does anybody have any idea how many users Apple Maps actually has? Local Search 0
N Creating new location groups, does it affect other owners/managers' views? Multi-Location Issues 2
Danish Blackmail Review (Asking money to remove it) | Google support does not wish to take it down Local Reviews 2
TimH FB app iphone does not show recommendations Local Reviews 0
LocalSEODat Using UTM for GMB link to website. Does that mess w/ citation matching, rankings or anything negative effect? Google My Business & Google Maps 5
V Local Services Ad: Does using a different phone number in local services ad effect the organic ranking for my site Paid Search and Local Service Ads 5
Y One of my rivals bought 5 stars 100 spam reviews in 2 weeks Google does not care Google My Business & Google Maps 1
Tony Wang Google now does food ordering Google My Business & Google Maps 2
M GMB Virtual Care Link - Does the URL have to be on the website? Google My Business & Google Maps 1
djbaxter Does John Mueller have a side gig? Break Room: Chat and Off Topic 0
Zhanna Does Local SEO for small hotels return the investments? Google My Business & Google Maps 4
erickseo Does having a tracking phone number as primary instead of our regular phone number hurt ranking? Local Search 13
FriarTuck00 How Long Does It Take to Get Duplicates Removed? Google My Business & Google Maps 5
djbaxter Google reminder: Structured Data Does Not Impact Ranking Organic SEO 0
djbaxter Mythbusting: Linking out to authority (or other) sites does not help rankings Organic SEO 15
F Does punycode help ranking? Ranking Puzzles 1
kathleen.rhodes Does anyone have experience with eClincher for posting to GMB (and social sites)? Local SEO Tools & Software 1

Similar threads

Login / Register

Already a member?   LOG IN
Not a member yet?   REGISTER

Most UpVoted Answers

Trending: Most Viewed

LocalU Podcasts

  Promoted Posts

New advertising option: A review of your product or service posted by a Sterling Sky employee. This will also be shared on the Sterling Sky & LSF Twitter accounts, our Facebook group, LinkedIn, and both newsletters. More...
Google Product Exert


Top Bottom