More threads by Linda Buquet

Linda Buquet

Local Search Expert
Jun 28, 2012
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Hi guys, I have not done a ranking puzzle for awhile and have a good one for you.

Something tells me that if together we can figure this one out...
It may give us a big clue as far as how 'she' thinks and what she likes.

Search Term: Orlando Dentist

Screen Shot of Top 3 + Search Map

<img src="" alt="OrlandoDentist" width="65%" />​

Here are some reasons that Dentist listing should not be ranking A in a competitive metro like that

.:. Unclaimed and bare. (I know being claimed does not make you rank higher but many out there say, to rank high you need to claim your listing)

.:. Only 1 review (kinda shows # of reviews is not the biggest deciding factor)

.:. Farthest from Centroid (of the top listings)

.:. Wrong Dentist. That Dentist does not even work there any more I don't think

.:. Is NOT even on 1st page in maps (classic) ranking. (Ranks #12, on page #2.)

.:. I thought maybe backlinks but did a quick check and does not look like it
(But I don't really analyze BL much or have good tools. Maybe someone else can check.)

.:. Ranks #1 in pure organic even though title tag and on-site SEO not very good.
(Title tag does not even have Orlando Dentist OR even the word Dentist)

Check maps (USE CLASSIC)
There is even a listing for the practice itself that ranks higher for phone search than the Chen May J DDS listing does. And that practice listing has more reviews.

One thing I didn't do is citation research. But citations would not be what's giving it the #1 organic ranking. And why is that organic ranking tying to a Dr listing that's unclaimed with 1 review instead of the practice listing? Maybe that's the previous Dentist and she has a lot of citations? OK out of time but just a quickie check.

"East Orlando Dental" "(407) 282-2101" 29,800 matches
"May" "Chen" "(407) 282-2101" only 1,360

So what I DO know, is that contrary to popular belief, the organic algo still controls the
ranking order at the top of the pack. So in part the A ranking is due to the #1 organic ranking.

But other than having Orlando in the practice name and domain name, I'm not sure why this one is even ranking #1. (Several others have Orlando in domain that are not even in the pack.)

Plus... that listing does not even rank on page one on maps and is far enough from centroid that it normally would not blend and land in the pack UNLESS it had something really strong going for it. And I'm just not seeing anything strong.

Plus... why is the old Dr listing that's not even there, outranking the practice listing?

Let's reverse engineer the algo on this one and see what we can learn!

Who can solve this ranking puzzle???

Oh and SIC 'EM Danno... this Dentist needs help. Go for it! :)

<meta property="og:type" content="article"><meta property="og:title" content=""><meta property="og:description" content="Who can solve this ranking puzzle??? Let's reverse engineer and see if Google is hiding a ranking secret inside!">
<meta property="og:image" content="">
First thing I am seeing is the domain age of each listing in the pack. Other than #d (11 Yrs), East Orlando Dental is 8 yrs old. Rest are sitting at 3-5 yrs.

and a nice little perk from DemandForce:

---------- Post Merged at 12:40 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 12:30 PM ----------

Loving the Title tags

1. Central Florida Dentistry - Orlando Dentistry - East Orlando Dental

2. Orlando Dentist | Dentist in Orlando | Downtown Orlando Female Dentist | Northeast Orlando Cosmetic Dentist

3. Orlando Dentist, Central Florida Dentists, Dr. Anne Reid, Mills Park Dental, Orlando Florida general dentistry

4. Dentistry Orlando FL 32826, Cosmetic Family General Implant Orthodontic Sedation Dentistry, Dental Care, Dental Treatment Florida

5. Dentistry At Lake Nona, Full-service Central Florida Dental Office

6. Orlando Dentist - Dr. Jorge Angulo

7. Orlando Dentist - Delaney Park Dentistry - Your Downtown Orlando Dental Office
Good call on the domain age Justin.

And yes I noticed the DF reviews however...

All those juicy reviews and the extra citations DF gives are tied to the PRACTICE listing.
Not to May's listing, which make it even more puzzling.

AHHHH discovered something interesting...

Go here in CLASSIC Maps:

Click back and forth between Chen's and the practice listing.

The practice listing does not have a marker and says: "Placement on map is approximate"

I think of the practice listing did not have a problem, then it would be the one in the pack which would make more sense. But since it's suffering from some kind of location trust it's locked out and the Chen listing took it's place.

I think Google prefers E instead of East spelled out, but spelling out East should not whack it's map marker?

Gotta run... back in a bit...
There are also two other listings on Maps for two other doctors at East Orlando Dental - Reiter Ross P DDS and Mancini Rudolph DDS - marked as "Permanently Closed". Not sure if that is adding to the confusion.
Thanks Ron, good catch!

I meant to mention that too, it was in the 1st maps search I shared.

What's interesting there is that sometimes when I do ranking troubleshooting and someone has dropped out of the pack, I see a closed listing like those and assume the main listing is NOT ranking because having a listing closed at same address and phone causes confusion and suppresses the main listing. In this case it does not seem to be hurting Chen's ranking but something else may be up with the practice listing?

I think that practice listing is merged with the new Drs listing and one of them WAS claimed and is spammy. (Note 2nd name in edit details.)

Check edit details


Dentist, Cosmetic Dentist, Cosmetic Dentist, Dental Clinic, Emergency Dental Service, Dental,Dentist,
Dentist oviedo, colonial dentist, Alafaya Dentist, Waterfall Lakes Dentist, Dentist, Dentists

Practice does not even rank for KW+ exact address:

Dentist 11780 East Colonial Dr, Orlando, FL

So looks like it may be suspended.
So I need to run to get ready for the big Google Hangout, but so far I think it appears that due to the #1 ranking organic placement that one is A in the pack.

And the practice listing which is MUCH stronger, with more reviews, citations and all those big DemandForce reviews and citations, SHOULD/WOULD be the one to rank if it was not penalized. Since it's penalized that other old Dr listing, at same address and phone and with practice name in the listing, took it's place.

He needs help!

Sic 'em Danno!
This looks to me like Google is putting more weight on the related term "dental". Did a few searches in other competitive areas and sites with the word Dental in title are ranking #1. york dentist

New York is interesting - the first local result is the Greater New York Dental Meeting. Seems to indicate this even more so.

What do you think?
Thanks Tom, I've kinda noticed that too.

I think to the algo Dental and Dentist are synonyms. You can tell by the fact that when you search for Dentist, she bolds Dental. So if you have Dental in your name, it's like you have Dentist in your name.

I see American Dental Association in the A spot for LA, but that makes sense since an association would have more links and citations and people talking about it and clicking to it, than an indiv Dentist would. And I often see assoc's at of the pack.

But I don't see New York State Dental Association in the pack. Just in organic.
Dr Chen from my top post is out of the pack now.

So is Mills Dental and in checking, they have some spam violations, so it's good they got knocked out.

Wish I'd taken a screen shot of the entire pack to see what else shifted because I don't remember all the players and who was where before - but seems like a pretty big shift because I don't recognize several of those names.
I'm seeing other ranking changes in other packs and the local weather report shows an uptick today.

For example: los angeles personal injury attorney I KNOW Nadrich and Eline are always at the top of the pack and are strong marketers. Now they are bottom of the pack.

Anyone else noticing changes?

FYI I just started experimenting with a new free tool for checking pack changes visually.
It's super cool!

Will post it Tues if I can.
What I'm seeing in a few packs I watch are new ones jumping up into the pack that are not usual 7 pack players so that is moving one or two of the regulars down or out.

Have not had time to analyze but the ones I've checked - it's usually spammy ones that were not in the pack that got in. Almost more like the local algo loosen a spam filter. :(

But again, I have not had time to do a deep dive, that's just initial observation.
There was a buzz of a rollout of an update last Sat. We saw a drop in specific Keywords of a slot or two starting Sunday with recovery in the last couple days. Read the discussion...

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